my humble comment

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2008-10-15 14:51:00 provens

　　hey there, have you read this article on NY Times? It seems that the journalist and many people are blaming him for his 'deregulation'. The reporter even mentioned his friend Ayn Rand, commenting that Rand's ideas has a great influence on Greenspan, even for his capital market policy.
　　
　　http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/09/business/economy/09greenspan.html?_r=1&oref=slogin
　　
　　I finished chapters before Clinton administration before, then I jumped to the chapter on China.

2008-10-15 15:26:10 Steven升级中

　　格老的观点,当今的金融市场,规模太大,速度太快,政府是无法有效的管制的.
　　人啊,格老在位,经济繁荣的时候都念着人家的好.现在一有风吹草动的,就开始反攻倒算了

2008-10-15 15:49:37 provens

　　yep, people are overacting the spirit of skepticism.
　　He's the person who embraces the free market, if he were still the chair of FED, I doubt he would agree on the bailout bill.
　　
　　People are sophisticated. I guess that explains why it is getting hard for us to make true friends as we age.hahahaha~

2008-10-15 18:17:21 Steven升级中

　　sure,谁说的来的,基本上高中之后就没法交到知心朋友了

2008-10-27 07:03:48 cloud_zhou

　　Mr. Greenspan is a hard-core republican who tolerated the expansion of new financial instruments without effective regulation, and compromised the line between fiscal policy and monetary policy to accommodate neo-conservatism.
　　
　　Why people still worship this guy?

2008-10-27 13:22:25 Steven升级中

　　楼上,别忘了人家是过去十几年经济繁荣的基石人物呢.管制是必要的,但管制过多一定会扼杀竞争和繁荣,不就成了某党了么.

2008-10-28 15:33:15 cloud_zhou

　　what? who told you that? This is ludicrous.
　　
　　Don't forget Mr. G is a human being, not an almighty immortal. You may say Mr. G, as a policy maker, led the fed in the right course. Well, that is what he get paid for. In other words, Mr. G would get the blame if he screwed up. In fact, he did admit errors on regulation during a Congressional hearing last week.

2008-10-29 00:02:10 provens

　　Yes, he admitted partial errors. He's a person working for politicians; I guess he has to balance his position between monetary policy and politics.
　　
　　If there were another man as the FED Chair, I'm not sure whether the US economy would be better or worse today.

2008-10-29 10:41:43 Steven升级中

　　是否功过,恐怕只有再过几十年,才能看清楚吧
　　就像现在我们能判断大萧条时期的胡佛政府一样

2008-10-30 13:40:08 cloud_zhou

　　"If there were another man as the FED Chair, I'm not sure whether the US economy would be better or worse today."
　　
　　Damn right. There is no super man or superior human beings in real life. You can't credit one priest after he prayed for good weather. Mr. G and his successors don't have any magic wander beneath their suits. They play this game under the same social principal or science just as a speculator did on the street. The real difference is that guys like Mr. G have unlimited access to all kinds of information or intelligence report. If the same information was released to the market before fed took any action or decided not to take any action, the market would react as if it is Mr. G himself. Guess what, if Mr. G does not follow the rule, the market would conclude that either he was bluffing or he knew some additional information.
　　
　　The point is that I don't worship those names, their childhood, or the funny smiles on their face, neither have any blind faith in their analysis. Reasoning is what fundamentally makes everyone free and equal. It is a shame when we give up this bliss to our own ignorance.
　　
　　BTW, regulation itself is not communism, not socialism, nor dictatorship in any sort. In fact, there is a real difference between communism and socialism despite what the Chinese government has said about itself.
　　
　　Since the beginning of cold war, republican has been yelling the idea of small government and big market when the free Medicare system and social security system were adopted by the other remaining developed countries unanimously. Now, any educated republican will admit that market has its own deficiency which cannot be corrected by self-regulation. Therefore, some degree of regulation from the government is necessary and inevitable. After all, we are not living in an anarchy society. You may argue any regulatory provisions necessary or not. But, please do me a favor, don't play any cards on ideology.

2008-10-30 18:11:52 Steven升级中

　　楼上,别的不说,你最后一段说的社会保障制度,恐怕站不住脚吧.要是米国实行西欧那样社会主义的制度,鼓励懒惰,惩罚苦干创新.国立恐怕早就衰退不知到哪里了

2008-11-01 14:53:14 cloud_zhou

　　Believe it or not, Social Security Act enacted in 1935 by President Roosevelt provides coverage on federal old-age benefit, surviviors benefit, disability benefit, unemployment benefit, temporary assistance for needy families, medicare for aged or disabled, state children's health insurance program, and etc. I am not saying the system is perfect. In fact, most people would argue that the US government's involvement is minimal comparing to the other developed countries. But without all these wealth-transfer program, I can't imagine how many riots or social revolution would have been recorded on US history.
　　
　　Again, why is it so important to have a two digit GDP growth? If only 10% of the population can actually enjoy the benefit of two digit growth of wealth, what do you going to say when you are not in that top 10%?
　　
　　And I can tell you this, people in that top 10% would care less about the wealth growth rate if there is a social storm roaring on the street.

2008-11-01 16:20:21 Steven升级中

　　基本的社会保障当然是必须的,所谓level the playing field.
　　the way I read your post, you seem a bit like the populist Mr.G mentioned in the book.
　　business help the poor, not all the welfare programmes
　　of course the top 10% people who are doing well are actually helping the poor, it's called the invisible hand.
　　the top 10% pay more taxes, offer job opportunities, and consume.
　　

2008-11-02 16:35:07 cloud_zhou

　　"business help the poor?" what are you on high or something? give me a fucking break!
　　
　　business was never initiated for helping people. it is for maximizing profit. if they did has any sense of philanthropy, they would pay decent wages to workers, stop dumping stinky shit into river, and make sure their products safe.
　　
　　now let's go back to your statement, "business help the poor." when you are employed by someone or any company, you are exchanging your labour for monetary compensation at a predetermined price. the company get what they want and you get what you need. you are not taking advantage of anyone because you've worked your ass off. the fact that you can't pay off your rents has nothing to do with your boss. they don't give a shit whether you lived in a dump or not. why? because how you spent your pay cheques is never their concern, and they are under no legal obligation to concern about your financial hardship other than the salary they have to pay. you have too many mouths to feed, go get a fucking second job. nothing is free.
　　
　　as about the top 10% people, they don't help the poor unless for considerations such as tax relief or PR campaign.
　　
　　it is true that they paid more tax, but don't forget, the taxes they paid were spent by the government to maintain the social structure and defend property ownership, which they owned most.
　　
　　it is absolutely true that the top 10% people offer job opportunities and consume more. but don't give me some shits like "invisible hand".
　　
　　supposedly, a rich guy paid a prostitute for anal sex. did he help the prostitute? yes. did he offer job opportunites? yes. did he consume? yes. was it invisible hand? no, i call it invisible fuck.
　　

2008-11-03 10:04:35 Steven升级中

　　楼上的左倾思想很严重啊:)
　　呵,就像民主党跟共和党的分歧一直存在一样
　　各有各的哲学吧,我是相信克里芝总统说的:the business of America is business
　　只有business才能提供税收\就业\社会繁荣
　　当然,你要认为这只是剥削,我也没话说

2008-11-09 17:14:11 cloud_zhou

　　"Throughout the nation men and women, forgotten in the political philosophy of the Government, look to us here for guidance and for more equitable opportunity to share in the distribution of national wealth… I pledge you, I pledge myself to a new deal for the American people… This is more than a political campaign. It is a call to arms."
　　
　　-- Franklin D. Roosevelt
　　
　　Just in case you don’t know. Unlike Calvin Coolidge who was criticized for part of laissez-faire government, F. Roosevelt initiated programs such as Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation (FDIC), Tennessee Valley Authority (TVA), and the United States Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC), and the Social Security System.
　　
　　You just don't get it, do you? This is not about difference between political parties, ideologies, or philosophies. This is about people like you and me, our father and grandfather, and our children and grandchildren who will suffer the political and economic consequence more severely than any top 10% wealthy pigs. It's a pure moral question, which should be answered with integrity and clear conscience. Honestly, I just can’t find any of those in your replies.

2008-11-09 20:01:18 Steven升级中

　　top 10% wealthy pigs?
　　
　　我真的是没话可说了

2008-11-10 16:33:06 cloud_zhou

　　Did I hurt your feelings? I am sorry.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% wealthy pigs, who believe that their business is the business of entire nation.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% SOBs who believe that it is ok to make a profit by paying employees less than minimal wages.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% supper human assholes who believe that they have the right to put more damage on the environment simply because they have more money than anyone else does.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% morons who believe that reducing the fluctuation of their equity account should be used as a guideline for initiating national policy.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% dumb asses, who believe socialism is the same as communism.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% retards who support a presidential candidate referring Africa as a country.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% fanatics who disrespect women’s right of abortion and same sex marriage.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% shitheads who think presidential campaign is a TV reality show.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% faggots who believe that their constitutional rights contain more pages than everyone else’s.
　　
　　I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% fake aristocracies who believe that their blood entitles them more privilege than what average people have,
　　
　　And I apologize for assuming you are not in the top 10% compulsive liars who believe that they are the true patriots of this country.

2008-11-10 17:43:15 Steven升级中

　　派楼上作为我党卧底去发展米共吧:)
　　

2008-12-06 00:30:00 lava

　　现在的萧条是金融市场的大调整
　　我们没有理由悲观
　　人的信念和追求总会让市场走上正轨的
　　这才是真正格老的观点

2008-12-06 17:27:04 Steven升级中

　　顶楼上
　　a market without failure is like a religion without sin
　　每次的市场调整,都会让人类作为整体学会更多,进步更多
　　尤其要相信美国的政治制度和经济体系是开放的,有自我治愈调整机制的

2008-12-07 09:33:38 lava

　　"a market without failure is like a religion without sin"
　　这话是格老说的？

2008-12-07 19:52:13 Steven升级中

　　不是 ,某大牛说的 ,忘了是哪个老大了

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